Obnoxious Neighbour
Thu, 17 Feb 2005, 08:06 ambruce14 posts in thread
Obnoxious Neighbour
Thu, 17 Feb 2005, 08:06 amI am looking for advice on behalf of the Goldfields Repertory Club, we are facing problems from a neighbour who has made complaints to our City Council about Noise Pollution. Our Theatre has been in its present location since the 1940s or 50s and in 1998 the City Council approved a development of 8 units next door! Our Christmas show saw the Council Enviromental officer pay us two visits and in our current poduction we have had to endure rocks being thrown onto our roof, to celebrate opening night.
The GRC committee has asked me to investigate the options so we can better soundproof our Theatre. The original Theatre burnt down in the mid 70s and the present building started Life as an old Railways Shed I've been told. It has a Corrugated Iron Roof that is supported by large timber trusses and all that is between the stage and the outside world ( other than the Iron) is some dodgy Sisalation. My thoughts are to line with Chipboard and Insulation Batts or a more suitable material but am unsure of what will be best for the Soundproofing and the Acoustics for the auditorium. I dont want to make it soundproof to the outside and then find that the material is also damping the Actors Voices. The Theatre only seats 90 so we aren't talking about huge spaces. As a Community Theatre Group our budgets are also a big consideration.
The GRC committee has asked me to investigate the options so we can better soundproof our Theatre. The original Theatre burnt down in the mid 70s and the present building started Life as an old Railways Shed I've been told. It has a Corrugated Iron Roof that is supported by large timber trusses and all that is between the stage and the outside world ( other than the Iron) is some dodgy Sisalation. My thoughts are to line with Chipboard and Insulation Batts or a more suitable material but am unsure of what will be best for the Soundproofing and the Acoustics for the auditorium. I dont want to make it soundproof to the outside and then find that the material is also damping the Actors Voices. The Theatre only seats 90 so we aren't talking about huge spaces. As a Community Theatre Group our budgets are also a big consideration.
bruceThu, 17 Feb 2005, 08:06 am
I am looking for advice on behalf of the Goldfields Repertory Club, we are facing problems from a neighbour who has made complaints to our City Council about Noise Pollution. Our Theatre has been in its present location since the 1940s or 50s and in 1998 the City Council approved a development of 8 units next door! Our Christmas show saw the Council Enviromental officer pay us two visits and in our current poduction we have had to endure rocks being thrown onto our roof, to celebrate opening night.
The GRC committee has asked me to investigate the options so we can better soundproof our Theatre. The original Theatre burnt down in the mid 70s and the present building started Life as an old Railways Shed I've been told. It has a Corrugated Iron Roof that is supported by large timber trusses and all that is between the stage and the outside world ( other than the Iron) is some dodgy Sisalation. My thoughts are to line with Chipboard and Insulation Batts or a more suitable material but am unsure of what will be best for the Soundproofing and the Acoustics for the auditorium. I dont want to make it soundproof to the outside and then find that the material is also damping the Actors Voices. The Theatre only seats 90 so we aren't talking about huge spaces. As a Community Theatre Group our budgets are also a big consideration.
The GRC committee has asked me to investigate the options so we can better soundproof our Theatre. The original Theatre burnt down in the mid 70s and the present building started Life as an old Railways Shed I've been told. It has a Corrugated Iron Roof that is supported by large timber trusses and all that is between the stage and the outside world ( other than the Iron) is some dodgy Sisalation. My thoughts are to line with Chipboard and Insulation Batts or a more suitable material but am unsure of what will be best for the Soundproofing and the Acoustics for the auditorium. I dont want to make it soundproof to the outside and then find that the material is also damping the Actors Voices. The Theatre only seats 90 so we aren't talking about huge spaces. As a Community Theatre Group our budgets are also a big consideration.
jassepThu, 17 Feb 2005, 11:17 am
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
Hi Bruce,
Why don't you investigate giving the residents of the units season passes for 2 as a 'neighbourly gift' and as a way of compensating them for the occasional noise discrepancy.
It's good publicity, good PR and even if they don't use the tickets themselves, they will pass them on to others who might never have bothered coming along before.
Just a thought - could be a darn sight cheaper than redesigning your theatre!
Jason
Why don't you investigate giving the residents of the units season passes for 2 as a 'neighbourly gift' and as a way of compensating them for the occasional noise discrepancy.
It's good publicity, good PR and even if they don't use the tickets themselves, they will pass them on to others who might never have bothered coming along before.
Just a thought - could be a darn sight cheaper than redesigning your theatre!
Jason
bruceThu, 17 Feb 2005, 11:37 am
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
Thanks Jason, we have considered that, but it is only one neighbour who complains. That is all that's required under the new Laws apparently, one complaint is enough for the Authorities to give us grief, and withdraw our license. My personal thoughts are, that it isn't just the noise, he doesn't say Boo during the Dress Rehersals that can go later than the actual Show and be louder, as you have the chorus in full voice in an empty venue without an Audience to absorb some of the sound. He always seem to find his Voice & bad language (and now Rock throwing) skills on Opening night. The Executive of the Rep have had a Meeting with the Council Officer and we need to be seen to be doing something about the sound levels as well. We may be able to apply for exemptions as a venue that is not in operation every week, but we still have to take some steps to alliviate the problem.
Lord ByronThu, 17 Feb 2005, 12:44 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
Dear Bruce
ThereÂ’s a bikie group in the Goldfields who have quite a reputation for fixing things, where justice has been a bit slow or recalcitrant.
A visit from the boys would no doubt see the bloke stop throwing rocks and cutting his language down to a barely audible gasp.
And, it would make a very funny one act play.
[%sig%]
ThereÂ’s a bikie group in the Goldfields who have quite a reputation for fixing things, where justice has been a bit slow or recalcitrant.
A visit from the boys would no doubt see the bloke stop throwing rocks and cutting his language down to a barely audible gasp.
And, it would make a very funny one act play.
[%sig%]
Walter PlingeFri, 18 Feb 2005, 02:56 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
I think the idea of chipboard and insulation bats is a pretty good idea; the chipboard should stop the sound from being absorbed by the bats and bounce it back into the theatre.
Relining the Theatre is going to be expensive, but if it has to be done, try approaching perhaps the council for a grant to help in the upgrade. I am pretty sure there are a few places where you can get grants for improvements to the theatre.
Perhaps soundproofing the walls down the sides of the theatre may help with this as they are not lined – and an added bonus may be that the theatre may be warmer in the winter for both cast, crew and patrons.
Lining the roof would cut down on the noise when there is a rain/hail storm and you would still be able to hear the actors on stage.
Here is a website that might give you some ideas on things that could be done. I am not suggesting that you buy from this site but it may help with giving you some ideas on what is around...
http://getridofnoise.com/
There is a link for ceiling and wall panels on that page
http://getridofnoise.com/CeilingWallPanel.html
Relining the Theatre is going to be expensive, but if it has to be done, try approaching perhaps the council for a grant to help in the upgrade. I am pretty sure there are a few places where you can get grants for improvements to the theatre.
Perhaps soundproofing the walls down the sides of the theatre may help with this as they are not lined – and an added bonus may be that the theatre may be warmer in the winter for both cast, crew and patrons.
Lining the roof would cut down on the noise when there is a rain/hail storm and you would still be able to hear the actors on stage.
Here is a website that might give you some ideas on things that could be done. I am not suggesting that you buy from this site but it may help with giving you some ideas on what is around...
http://getridofnoise.com/
There is a link for ceiling and wall panels on that page
http://getridofnoise.com/CeilingWallPanel.html
Walter PlingeFri, 18 Feb 2005, 03:04 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
ps
this site seems informative about sound proofing too
http://www.soundproofing101.com
cheers
this site seems informative about sound proofing too
http://www.soundproofing101.com
cheers
Walter PlingeFri, 18 Feb 2005, 04:59 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
what about egg cartons lots of sounds studios etc use empty egg cartons to soundproof areas
Greg RossFri, 18 Feb 2005, 06:53 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
The superbly talented Dean Alston saw it this way (see attachment), in today's (Friday 18th February) edition of The West Australian – see “Inside Cover.”
I like the eggshells idea, purely as it gives the good folk from the Goldfields Rep Club an opportunity to use the eggs in any rotten way they see fit!
Surely the Kalgoorlie Boulder Council will now help out, after being shamed in the daily newspaper?
Cheers
Greg Ross
I like the eggshells idea, purely as it gives the good folk from the Goldfields Rep Club an opportunity to use the eggs in any rotten way they see fit!
Surely the Kalgoorlie Boulder Council will now help out, after being shamed in the daily newspaper?
Cheers
Greg Ross
Bass GuySat, 19 Feb 2005, 12:33 am
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
One thing to maybe think of is next time you do a tech run, have the Council Environment Officer come round with a decibel meter. As I understand it, you can now get these exquisite little devices on mobile phones now.
Hint: I want one for Christmas! Meter, that is...
If the measurements taken by the officer are within the legal limits (76dB or thereabouts- someone is sure to correct me if I'm wrong) you should have no problems. Buy the neighbour a set of earmuffs for Christmas or something- or petition to have the inconvenient swine evicted for abusing/vandalising your property.
It doesn't take much to go over 70dB, however. Most car stereos will hit that roughly a third of the way up. It all depends on the show you are doing. The Who's "Tommy" might be out of the question...
And as far as damping the actors voices- if you soundproof the interior walls (and all methods discussed would work) the actors would still be audible in a 90 seat venue. In fact, going for an anechoic chamber effect could be beneficial. Expensive, but beneficial.
El
Hint: I want one for Christmas! Meter, that is...
If the measurements taken by the officer are within the legal limits (76dB or thereabouts- someone is sure to correct me if I'm wrong) you should have no problems. Buy the neighbour a set of earmuffs for Christmas or something- or petition to have the inconvenient swine evicted for abusing/vandalising your property.
It doesn't take much to go over 70dB, however. Most car stereos will hit that roughly a third of the way up. It all depends on the show you are doing. The Who's "Tommy" might be out of the question...
And as far as damping the actors voices- if you soundproof the interior walls (and all methods discussed would work) the actors would still be audible in a 90 seat venue. In fact, going for an anechoic chamber effect could be beneficial. Expensive, but beneficial.
El
crgwllmsSun, 20 Feb 2005, 08:11 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour - closer to home
Last night of The Bear (and the first part of Real Inspector Hound) was marred by an inordinate amount of noise pollution coming from a Festival of Perth event at the Somerville auditorium. Apparently there was a film event being shown with accompaniment by a live band... whose decibels were CRANKING. Didn't mind so much when it was just an ethereal keyboard permeating the entire space up the hill at St George's, but the drum and bass was a bit hard to justify in a Chekov.
I believe some awareness of the problem was exhibited by the Festival...they scheduled the UWA performance of Black Swan's 'Zastrozzi' to start later, at 9.30pm. But it was unfortunate that they were oblivious to the non-Festival performances.
And honestly, from standing out the front of St Georges (the other side of Stirling Hwy, and a reasonable distance from the Somerville), the noise levels were pretty major. I could not possibly imagine myself standing anywhere in the vicinity of the Somerville Theatre and being able to enjoy a musical performance at that volume.
Shame for the performers of The Bear, who I imagine were really distracted. And for the capacity crowd on our final night...if you were distracted I suggest you let the Perth Festival organisers know.
Cheers
Craig
[%sig%]
Walter PlingeSun, 20 Feb 2005, 08:23 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
I have used egg cartons, however they can cause other problems, with vermin & what have you!
Also you may have to have them fire retardant treated, & as you have an unlined tin shed, IÂ’d worry about condensation or water egress, braking them down!
Actually just insulating the walls & ceiling, then lining the building & covering the windows will reduce the outside sound level. However instead of chipboard, IÂ’d opt for MDF as a better & cheaper option. You can get fire retardant treated boards, if you need to! Also you can use thinner boards, than you would using chipboard. Chipboard will break down if damaged & also assist vermin.
All of this would be a plus anyway - to reduce the temperature in a tin shed, on the Goldfields!
If you have problems also with rain drumming on the roof, during performances? Which may not be a problem in Kal, as it doesnÂ’t happen that often!
If it does you can use shadecloth to cover the roof, which stops the drumming, if it ever comes down in the size of 2 bob bits there? [Shadecloth is available in up to 3.6M widths. also good for scrims & transformation cloths!]
Also you may have to have them fire retardant treated, & as you have an unlined tin shed, IÂ’d worry about condensation or water egress, braking them down!
Actually just insulating the walls & ceiling, then lining the building & covering the windows will reduce the outside sound level. However instead of chipboard, IÂ’d opt for MDF as a better & cheaper option. You can get fire retardant treated boards, if you need to! Also you can use thinner boards, than you would using chipboard. Chipboard will break down if damaged & also assist vermin.
All of this would be a plus anyway - to reduce the temperature in a tin shed, on the Goldfields!
If you have problems also with rain drumming on the roof, during performances? Which may not be a problem in Kal, as it doesnÂ’t happen that often!
If it does you can use shadecloth to cover the roof, which stops the drumming, if it ever comes down in the size of 2 bob bits there? [Shadecloth is available in up to 3.6M widths. also good for scrims & transformation cloths!]
bruceMon, 21 Feb 2005, 03:19 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
Thanks for all the Help, Advice and Humour, I will check out the Web addresses. The egg carton solution has been suggested by a couple of people up here as well. I was concerned aout the Fire Regulation aspect. I hadn't considered the Rodent high rise risk. The sound proofing against the Rain will be an added bonus, I think if it rained up here during a Performance these days half the punters would rush outside in disbelief. If we should be so lucky as to get some Rain again! These days the Rep put on more performances than the Rain Gods. The use of MDF rather than Chipboard sounds good.
Cheers and Cold Beers
Bruce
Cheers and Cold Beers
Bruce
Walter PlingeSun, 27 Feb 2005, 07:23 am
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
G'day,
Not so much a correction, as steering you (and other readers) in the right direction...
On the site:
http://www.safetyline.wa.gov.au/PageBin/noisgenl0001.htm
is a lot of good information about noise level exposure limits. All sound designer/operators should be aware of this information. Sadly, many aren't!
As for a sound pressure level meter, the Jaycar electronics stores have one for around $175. Or, Radio Parts (in Melbourne) have the same one -- different packaging -- for around $130. At either price they would be a worthwhile addition to your company stock.
Pay attention to the principles offered by other contributors to your question about noise abatement. Insulation is good. The method may be poor (rot/fire/vermin susceptibility). As has been said, your council may throw some money at you as a worthy community project, too!
Cheers,
Russell
Not so much a correction, as steering you (and other readers) in the right direction...
On the site:
http://www.safetyline.wa.gov.au/PageBin/noisgenl0001.htm
is a lot of good information about noise level exposure limits. All sound designer/operators should be aware of this information. Sadly, many aren't!
As for a sound pressure level meter, the Jaycar electronics stores have one for around $175. Or, Radio Parts (in Melbourne) have the same one -- different packaging -- for around $130. At either price they would be a worthwhile addition to your company stock.
Pay attention to the principles offered by other contributors to your question about noise abatement. Insulation is good. The method may be poor (rot/fire/vermin susceptibility). As has been said, your council may throw some money at you as a worthy community project, too!
Cheers,
Russell
GSMon, 28 Feb 2005, 01:35 pm
Re: Obnoxious Neighbour
Can anyone please send me / repost the attachment? I cant see it here =(
Thanks
Thanks