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lighting myths and sales pitches

Sun, 8 Oct 2006, 10:35 pm
David Ashton12 posts in thread
I sell and repair gear,[declaration of interest]and I see on a weekly basis people being sold stuff they don't need or can't use and I would like to start off a thread of things to look out for.One big sales pitch which can cost thousands of dollars is the DMX sale.A DMX dimmer is in fact an analogue dimmer with a DMX decoder built in,DMX is not a type of dimmer ,it is a system of transferring data.So should you buy new dimmers?.Dimmers are like cars, there are good models and bad ones, unfortunately it usually takes a few years to find out.If you have good reliable analogue dimmers then buy a demux for $400 and keep the dimmers as new DMX units are going to cost $2000 per 12 way.The old Strand JTM and Minipack dimmers were particularly reliable.On the subject of desks, DMX desks are now so cheap they can be considered a consumable with a 24 way memory desk at $400 and a 48 way atb $660.Incidently no one has mentioned that Strand UK has gone broke and will not be selling or servicing gear any more.Another sales con is the RGB floods with a dmx controller,not only are they overpriced but highly inefficient as 80% of the light is lost in the filters and as you dim down the blue, the colour temperature of the lamp reduces so there is no blue content to dim.Finally a word on the quaint practice of pre-heating lamps, I recently got into heated discussion on this practice which lead me to do some experiments which proved that preheating lamps had virtually no effect after 4-5 mins and absolutely no effect after 25 minutes, so if you preheat your rig you can save time, power and lamplife by discontinuing this practice.Ilook forward to other feedback in this area.

Thread (12 posts)

David AshtonSun, 8 Oct 2006, 10:35 pm
I sell and repair gear,[declaration of interest]and I see on a weekly basis people being sold stuff they don't need or can't use and I would like to start off a thread of things to look out for.One big sales pitch which can cost thousands of dollars is the DMX sale.A DMX dimmer is in fact an analogue dimmer with a DMX decoder built in,DMX is not a type of dimmer ,it is a system of transferring data.So should you buy new dimmers?.Dimmers are like cars, there are good models and bad ones, unfortunately it usually takes a few years to find out.If you have good reliable analogue dimmers then buy a demux for $400 and keep the dimmers as new DMX units are going to cost $2000 per 12 way.The old Strand JTM and Minipack dimmers were particularly reliable.On the subject of desks, DMX desks are now so cheap they can be considered a consumable with a 24 way memory desk at $400 and a 48 way atb $660.Incidently no one has mentioned that Strand UK has gone broke and will not be selling or servicing gear any more.Another sales con is the RGB floods with a dmx controller,not only are they overpriced but highly inefficient as 80% of the light is lost in the filters and as you dim down the blue, the colour temperature of the lamp reduces so there is no blue content to dim.Finally a word on the quaint practice of pre-heating lamps, I recently got into heated discussion on this practice which lead me to do some experiments which proved that preheating lamps had virtually no effect after 4-5 mins and absolutely no effect after 25 minutes, so if you preheat your rig you can save time, power and lamplife by discontinuing this practice.Ilook forward to other feedback in this area.
NaMon, 9 Oct 2006, 09:57 am

Issues

Sounds like you have a lot of stuff on your mind David. I didn't know Strand has gone broke. I found and bought myself a book by Strand the other week; written in the 70s of course, but a good find. Though I don't really like their lights, I did spend much of my early tech years (ha - 'early') learning lighting using them. Fond memories. How sad. The Prompt Copy Networking emerging theatre professionals www.thepromptcopy.com Sticky Apple Legs http://stickyapplelegs.artsblogs.com Puppets in Melbourne www.freewebs.com/puppetsinmelbourne
JoeMcMon, 9 Oct 2006, 12:00 pm

I must agree with Daves

 I must agree with Daves post that in a lot respects the preheating is a myth.
Having cut my teeth on lighting back in the 50’s working with mainly vacuum bubbles, which a lot of Comeatre rigs will still be using, along with the gas filled ones in lot of older style lamps & hay burners. Preheating with the vacuum bubbles is still of value especially in cold conditions. Invariably when the filament is cold the power surge of an initial full power snap on or flash, will pop the bubble or damage the filament further. However this is dependant upon it’s previous usage & the inevitable thinning causing weak spots in the filament wire.
This site explains it better, while no means being an actual scientific data based test;-
http://freespace.virgin.net/tom.baldwin/bulbguide.html
 
I still find a good practice is to pretest the rig at about 10 -20% & do a quick walker, to check if that all the lamps are working before the show, when it is easier to visually check.
A lot of desk manufacturers use a built in preheat mode & this usually only helps with performing the preshow test.
  although when initially switching on Par cans from cold, you may experience a slight delay before they reach the optimum operating temperature. Similarly with QI lamps which have been run on very low for extended periods, the quartz envelope tends to blacken up. Which reduces light output further, but running on full for a short period will clean it up. In fact a lot of Architectural lighting systems have a periodical built in automatic cleaning mode, by putting them on full for a short time.

Thanks Dave for pointing out the inside story & some of the pit falls on  equipment available.
It great to get "Tech Talk’ postings of interest again, it’s almost as exciting as using Salt Water Dimmers!
 

JoeMcMon, 9 Oct 2006, 02:34 pm

 This is the press release

 This is the press release about the Strand Lighting.        

 
Genlyte Group Announces Acquisition of Strand Theatrical Lighting Business

LOUISVILLE, Ky., July 11 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Genlyte Group (GLYT) announced that it has reached an agreement to acquire the US and Hong Kong based operations of Strand Lighting and certain assets of Strand Lighting Ltd of UK as part of a restructuring being undertaken by Strand.

Strand was founded in 1916 as a manufacturer of entertainment lighting and lighting systems. The transaction includes but is not limited to the following product lines: C21 and CE21 Sine Wave Dimmer Racks, 6pack/3pack dimmer, Wallrack Dimmer cabinets, 500 series Control systems, Palette Series control consoles, and the SL series of Profile spot Luminaries.

The Strand business segments included in this transaction reported 2005 sales of approximately $31 million. The transaction purchase price includes a cash price of $8.5 million plus the assumption of approximately $5.0 million in trade payables and notes payable of the US and Hong Kong operations. Approximately 80 Strand US employees located in Los Angeles and 22 employees in Hong Kong will join the Genlyte organization.

Larry K. Powers, President and Chief Executive Officer of Genlyte Group commented, "We are pleased with the strategic benefits of this acquisition. This business will complement Genlyte's current Vari-Lite, Entertainment Technology, and Lightolier Controls product offerings. In addition, it broadens our presence in the Asian theatrical and entertainment lighting markets. We plan to operate Strand Lighting as a stand-alone business reporting to Steve Carson the Vice-President and General Manager of Genlyte's Controls, Vari-Lite and Entertainment Technology Division. We believe that this acquisition will break-even at the EBIT level, but it will be slightly dilutive after interest expense and taxes through the remainder of 2006. We anticipate that the acquisition will be accretive during 2007 after we complete the restructuring activities."

Steve Carson said, "We are excited about the opportunity to add the Strand Lighting brand and technologies to our portfolio. The addition of the Strand product line for the theatrical and architectural lighting markets completes our product package with excellent synergism and little overlap. While we look to expand our overall market penetration, we plan to continue to sell the Strand products through the existing Strand distribution and sales organizations. Genlyte's Vari-Lite and ET product lines have a significant presence in the European, Asian, and US markets. The Strand acquisition will enhance our product offering throughout the world. "

The Genlyte Group Incorporated (Nasdaq: GLYT) is a leading manufacturer of lighting fixtures, controls, and related products for the commercial, industrial and residential markets. Genlyte sells lighting and lighting accessory products under the major brand names of Capri/Omega, Chloride Systems, Crescent, Day-Brite, Gardco, Hadco, JJI Lighting, Ledalite, Lightolier, Lightolier Controls, Lumec, Shakespeare Composite Structures, Stonco, Thomas Lighting, Vari-Lite, Wide-Lite, and Canlyte.

The statements in this report with respect to future results, future expectations, and plans for future activities and synergies may be regarded as forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995, and actual results may differ materially from those currently expected. These forward-looking statements are generally identifiable by use of the words "believes," "expects," "intends," "anticipates," "plans to," "estimates," "projects," or similar expressions. Such future results are subject to various risks, such as the ability of the Company to meet new business sales goals and realize desired price increases, fluctuations in commodity and transportation costs, slowing of the overall economy, changes in foreign currency translation rates, increased interest costs arising from a change in the Company's leverage or change in rates, failure of the Company's plans to produce anticipated cost savings, the outcome of pending litigation, the timing and magnitude of capital expenditures, as well as other risks discussed in the Company's filing with the Securities Exchange Commission. The Company makes no commitment to disclose any revision to forward-looking statements, or any facts, events, or circumstances after the date hereof that may bear upon forward-looking statements.

For additional information about Genlyte please refer to the Company's web site at: http://www.genlyte.com.

SOURCE: The Genlyte Group Inc.

CONTACT: William G. Ferko, CFO, of The Genlyte Group Inc., +1-502-420-9502
"Safe Harbor" Statement under the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995: Statements in this press release regarding Genlyte Group's business which are not historical facts are "forward-looking statements" that involve risks and uncertainties. For a discussion of such risks and uncertainties, which could cause actual results to differ from those contained in the forward-looking statements, see "Risk Factors" in the Company's Annual Report or Form 10-K for the most recently ended fiscal year.

        

Walter PlingeMon, 9 Oct 2006, 03:44 pm

What the f.......!!

Hello, I have a life, do you?
stephendeanMon, 9 Oct 2006, 05:13 pm

Yes it is rather sad that

Yes it is rather sad that the name Strand may dissappear from theatres around the world. But this is the time of coporate take overs and now a fact of life.
David AshtonMon, 9 Oct 2006, 10:06 pm

warming globes

I read the article you mentioned and it supports what I was saying in that a preheat built into a previous cue will increase the filament resistance and reduce the surge current, but the filament has a very low thermal mass and it cools very quickly, which is pretty useful in a theatre light.But after 25 minutes it will have cooled to its original temperature and resistance which means that switching it on now will be exactly the same as without the preheat ritual.So in summary building some preheat in the cue before you want to flash up a light[particularly a 2K or parcan] can be useful but there is no residual effect of pre-heating the rig longer than 25 minutes before the show.
David AshtonMon, 9 Oct 2006, 10:09 pm

strand takeover

Was there an English translation?
JoeMcTue, 10 Oct 2006, 12:32 am

Your right Dave if the

Your right Dave if the filament was in free air & not in a bubble & enclosed in a lamp.
While the filament heat decreases rapidly it does so to that of the surrounding temp of it’s vacuum.
Thus it follows when considering the time it would take for the heat to dissipate through the bubble & instrument, in order to balance with the ambient temperature. This would be  greater than the 20 minutes or so pre show time, even on the coldest nights.

It only takes a matter of minutes to preheat the lamp, not 15  minutes or more as some practice.
I believe while it is a complete waste time & a total myth for gas filled globes, it still holds value as a practice with vacuum bubbles. However as in all cases this is up to the operator,  to consider & take into account all factors to preheat vacuum globes or not.

Walter PlingeTue, 10 Oct 2006, 03:13 pm

Learn how to write.

Learn how to write.
David AshtonTue, 10 Oct 2006, 09:42 pm

lamp pre-heating

The experiment to disprove the myth is quite simple.Take a cold T18 lamp in a fresnel and measure its resistance [9.1ohms] heat the lamp for 5 mins during which time the resistance reaches 120 ohms.Then unplug and measure resistance/time.Within 3 mins the resistance is down to 11 ohms and over 25 mins is down to the original 9.1 ohms.The resistance is the factor which controls the inrush current so whatever theoretical ideas there may be for pre-heating are not born out by the experimental evidence.QED
NaTue, 10 Oct 2006, 11:25 pm

Perhaps one for the

Perhaps one for the Mythbusters The Prompt Copy Networking emerging theatre professionals www.thepromptcopy.com Sticky Apple Legs http://stickyapplelegs.artsblogs.com Puppets in Melbourne www.freewebs.com/puppetsinmelbourne
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